I need help, amigos!

First of all wellcome my russian friend :fat:. There are some points that i can help you. It's true that PokerStars.es has now the most part of the traffic in Spain but, depending on your level of play, 888poker.es or PartyPoker.es has also traffic too if you play up to NL50 in cash games.

Concerning to your questions. You have to bring documents from your identification document and even bank extract or a bill in your name in order to perform your cashouts. The rake is bigger than other countrys, that's true, but could have been worse. And respecting the taxes you must pay, the problem has been clarified more or less, and now everything points that you only have to pay taxes for your benefits of the year.

I hope you enjoy your stay in Spain. Good luck 😉

Muchas gracias, for very fast answer! I am playing NL50 and NL100, mostly NL50, because was always spending most part of bankroll and was scared to keep money at cashier, after story with Full Tilt)))

If it is not hard for you, could you explain a little deeper about taxes? For example, i am playing online poker, winning (for easier to count 1000$ euros every month). So, finally i will have 12000$ for year? And what i must do with it? Or who must do? I must go to somewhere by myself and pay, or PokerStars sending information about all my cashouts to police? :apthy:

I am sorry, maybe i'm asking too easy and stupid questions, but in Russia we have no such problems with taxes 😄

Welcome to our comunnity! As u said we pay more rake, u can go to this website and check it: http://www.pokerstars.es/en/poker/room/rake/

We will have to pay taxes for our benefits of the year but I don't know how the non-residents in Spain will do it. In fact we dont know exactly how we are going to do it.

Sorry but I can't help u for the moment how u are going to do that, maybe someone here knows how about u (the non-residents) are going to declare ur incomes to the "Agencia Tributaria" . Don't think u can find something in their website but u can try it http://www.agenciatributaria.es/AEAT.internet/Inicio_en_GB/English/Non_residents/Non_residents.shtml

Here you have more info about your question:

enlace

http://www.poker-red.com/foros/showthread.php?83655-NOTA-DE-PRENSA-DEL-GOBIERNO-%28Respecto-al-juego-online%29&p=1150278#post1150278

Who could be playing poker in Russia!

Thanks, for links guys, but with my level of Spanish language was a little difficult to understand all and,especially, correct)) If it would be not difficult for you, could you answer some more questions, please.ROLLEYEs

Rake 5.15% and 4.5% not so catastrophic, i think we could survive 😄

But i still can't understand about taxes, how it works. For example i made deposit of 1000$, then for full year of playing i won 10000$. Of them 3000$ i left at account, 3000$ made cashout to credit card, with 3000$ made cashout to moneybookers, 2000$ send to friend. Also i was recieving rakeback to moneybookers and different player point at poker room, which i will can to change for money or play tourneys with them. And, let's even suppose, that i was playing not only at one poker room, but at two, or even at three 😄

So, how this "Agencia Tributaria" will know how much i won for 1 year? If even for myself it will be hard to count allEAGERNESs

Btw, i will get "Tarjeta De Residencia", so, maybe, i will be a little "resident")))

And, finally, you have this law only this year? So still noone didn't paid taxes? When is going to be first time, at end of 2012?

p.s. what will be if a person will not pay this taxes? (not me, just someone spanish payer) they will bring him to prison or what?

2p.s. by the way, how i understood even not all spanish players understanding what they must do and how it works))))))))

AfortunadBut i still can't understand about taxes, how it works. For example i made deposit of 1000$, then for full year of playing i won 10000$. Of them 3000$ i left at account, 3000$ made cashout to credit card, with 3000$ made cashout to moneybookers, 2000$ send to friend. Also i was recieving rakeback to moneybookers and different player point at poker room, which i will can to change for money or play tourneys with them. And, let's even suppose, that i was playing not only at one poker room, but at two, or even at three 😄

Hi,

Playing at multiple poker room doesn't change anything. All poker rooms get all your data, so for the "Ministerio de Hacienda" (Ministry of Treasury) it's simple to know which have been your global full-year profit. If you won 6000€ both at PokerStars.es and at 888poker.es... State entity will know you won 12.000€ and you must pay taxes regarding that money.

I assume poker rooms are reporting all the moves of the Spanish poker accounts to Ministry, thus either you cashout a few hundreds € or keep it in poker account it doesn't matter, you must pay for your net profit at the end of the year. I'm not sure, just assuming. Even though they just take into account the cashouts... you aren't going to keep the money ever.

In Spain, law about online poker was enforced last June... so very few people has paid taxes up to now.

Afortunad

But i still can't understand about taxes, how it works. For example i made deposit of 1000$, then for full year of playing i won 10000$. Of them 3000$ i left at account, 3000$ made cashout to credit card, with 3000$ made cashout to moneybookers, 2000$ send to friend. Also i was recieving rakeback to moneybookers and different player point at poker room, which i will can to change for money or play tourneys with them. And, let's even suppose, that i was playing not only at one poker room, but at two, or even at three 😄

1.- You cant send money to a friend by pokerstars.es, its not alowed with spanish software.

2.- I think that any .es poker platform gives you rakeback trough moneybookers. Their profit is smaller than in .com, beacuase the taxes.

So, how this "Agencia Tributaria" will know how much i won for 1 year? If even for myself it will be hard to count allEAGERNESs

3.- The poker enterprises must send to "hacienda" the total amount of profit of each one of us at 31/12/2012.



Btw, i will get "Tarjeta De Residencia", so, maybe, i will be a little "resident")))

And, finally, you have this law only this year? So still noone didn't paid taxes? When is going to be first time, at end of 2012?

4.- This law: From June 2012. the taxes will be paid in may-June 2013.

p.s. what will be if a person will not pay this taxes? (not me, just someone spanish payer) they will bring him to prison or what?

5.- jajajja, NO, if hacienda detects it, (we supose) they start a legal process and oficial comunications with the citizen. You can estimate that in 8-10 months Hacienda could get the money from your acounts, if you dont have enough money there, in 18 months aprox they will sell your propierties here..... and if you dont have any one..... then, they will be waiting till you open an acount, may be in 10 years.

2p.s. by the way, how i understood even not all spanish players understanding what they must do and how it works))))))))

6.- You are right, Most of us have no idea.

GL!!

nokeer y 7de9, muchas gracias para tus respuestas! 😄

One more question about "year" for which player must pay taxes. It is end of every year or one year, since he started to play? For, example if i will start to play this November, i will need to pay taxes at end of 2012 year, so in two months or after full year of playing, in November 2013?

And, by the way, you have in Spain "moneybookers" for use them with poker rooms? 😄

And one more question, anyway will be time, when i will ask it, if someone could advise any affiliates for play in Spanish poker rooms?

Balvfrom june to june, 365 days

You mean from november to november?)

No, is from june 2012 to june 2013 is for everybody the same.

Afortunadnokeer y 7de9, muchas gracias para tus respuestas! 😄

One more question about "year" for which player must pay taxes. It is end of every year or one year, since he started to play? For, example if i will start to play this November, i will need to pay taxes at end of 2012 year, so in two months or after full year of playing, in November 2013?.

For "hacienda" you earn money form 1/1/2012 to 31/12/2012 and pay in June 2013 the 2012 period.

Then, if you start playing spanish poker in November, in June 2013 you must pay for your earnings in 2012 year, in this case, whatever you earn in November + December.

And, by the way, you have in Spain "moneybookers" for use them with poker rooms? 😄

Yes in .com, i dont remember in ps.es, i think that not. Anyway you could use your skrill card by mastercard as a usual deposit in ps.es

And one more question, anyway will be time, when i will ask it, if someone could advise any affiliates for play in Spanish poker rooms?

Of course, this forum belongs to the same enterprises group that Educapoker. They have a lot of studying material for improve your poker skills. No rakeback, its true, but anyone offers it in Spain nowadays.

This is the link: http://www.educapoker.com/

GL!!

Just to give you an idea of the taxes you are expected to pay. If you earn 15k euros from poker you will be paying a tax rate of 16.2% or 2.4k euros. If you earn 25k your tax rate will be 21.2% and you will be paying 5.3k euros in taxes. You can see an article with practical cases in this link: http://www.poker-red.com/noticias/vistazo-a-tributacion-teoria-a-practica?ref=lo-mas There's a lot of misinformation and scaremongering with the tax issue currently here in Spain, but being realistic let me say that if I were to go to Russia or any other country for that matter and play poker while staying there (non-permanently) I wouldn´t see myself paying taxes. You get what I mean...

Oh and in case you still have fear or doubts about the state of poker in Spain, I am pretty sure that if you were a consistent winner at NL50 playing at the .com platforms you will easily win twice or three times as much money playing here in Spain. You will be happier than ever! The only real disadvantages have been for those playing higher than NL100 or those who played MTTS or SNGs, where the traffic is too low and there are no signs of improvement. Otherwise the profitability of the tables has increased dramatically. And then obviously there is the tax issue, but...

K dice!!!!??? en inglé?????

Otra vez muchas gracias para respuestas! 😄

Really, for me, it is very pleasant to feel friendly attitude from you all! And i'm very greatfull for all, who is helping me with advises and information! For give you a thanks for it, i will check my nuts hand at river, sitting in position and playing against you at poker table, if we will ever meet there 😉

7de9, so how i understood, if i will start playin from 01/01/2013, i will need to pay taxes only at Juny 2014?

7de[=#ff0000]Of course, this forum belongs to the same enterprises group that Educapoker. They have a lot of studying material for improve your poker skills. No rakeback, its true, but anyone offers it in Spain nowadays.

I'm sorry, maybe, i didn't understand real meaning of what you wrote? You are saying, that you have no rakeback in Spanish poker-rooms?

[B]Icarus, thank you for explication and advises! 😄 You would say, that level of spanish players are much lower, than level of another players?

Btw, you have any analogs, for example, of Sunday Million or something like that at PokerStars.es?

p.s. a little offtopic: when i was visiting Spain and speaking there with people, i get an image, that English language is not very popular among Spaniards, and most part of English-speaking people could say only something like:"Hey, you want a beer?" :D Even, when i was playing poker in Casino, in Aranjuez, among 10 people at table, only one man was speaking English, even card-dealer didn't))) Very nice too meet here people, with who i could speak english, till i will not learn spanish! Os debo una cerveza! 😉

D_LawyeK dice!!!!??? en inglé?????

Jijiji

Ya te joderemos, tu tranquilo por eso.

I confirm: no rakeback in spainsh .es

Afortunad Icarus, thank you for explication and advises! 😄 You would say, that level of spanish players are much lower, than level of another players? Oh yeah! The average spanish player suck at poker BIG TIME. It´s like going back to the golden years of online poker of 2006-2008.

D_LawyeK dice!!!!??? en inglé????? Google translator is your friend baby!

7deI confirm: no rakeback in spainsh .es

¡Joder! ¿Cómo puedes vivir sin rakeback? :nightmare:

Espero que, esto es verdad! 😉

By the way, what means "Pezqueñín"?) Google traductor doesn't know such word. I suppose, that small fish from "pez"?

AfortunadBy the way, what means "Pezqueñín"?) Google traductor doesn't know such word. I suppose, that small fish from "pez"?

Right 😉

Ajaj 😄 Thanks for explication!

Btw, i also wanted to ask, you have at this forum, or, maybe, at any another, diaries or blogs of poker players with discussions about poker-rooms, casinos and so on?

Hi, Fish is cause of the number of messages, ( not offensive) just a rank in the forum 😉

They are diaries and blogs of poker players from this forum, You have to click on " Planeta" at the main menu Up (near Videos) 😉

interesting topic especially that you have to pay taxes based on your yearly winnings. that makes a lot of sense....

AfortunadHola para todos!

I'm sorry for English, but my level of Spanish is not very high. But, i hope that it will increase soon 😄

I have some questions for spanish poker players and would be very greatfull for your answers!

I'm from Russia and my life made such turn, that very soon i'm going to come to Spain for long period of time! Here my hobby (and really not only hobby) was poker, i was winning money enough for life with it. I was playing in PokerStars, CakePoker and at Casinos in real life. How i know from news at Russian poker-sites, situation with online poker in Spain is a little difficult. How i know, you have a special "reservation" only for Spanish players, like PokerStars.es, PartyPoker.es and etc. But, again, how i know from information at russian language, more than 90% of traffic taking PokerStars, so it is pointless to speak about another rooms. I'm telling only information, which i get in russian, so, if it will be not truth, please correct me! 😄

I was reading, that you have some differences with another players. First, it is that for registration you need bring documents from bank. Second, that you have bigger rake. And third: the most scarefull is, that spanish poker players must pay crazy big taxes for play, doesn't matter how much player won or lost. So, it became impossible for earn money with poker. Finally, i found this forum (for be honest, it was reallu difficult :p), and, how i see, here are a lot of people, it is bringing me more optimism, that all is not so catastrophic in Spain!

I hope to find here interesting people, who could help me a little with acquaintance with Spanish poker community! From my side, i hope be interesting for you too 😉

Again sorry for English. I hope in some time, i will write here in Spanish!:welcoming:

where will you be based ?

Good luck with your change .....

krevix, gracias, amigo 😉

jackginteresting topic especially that you have to pay taxes based on your yearly winnings. that makes a lot of sense....

What do you mean? Could you explain your idea a little deeper, please?)

I'm going to live in Madrid. How i already checked, there are two big Casinos, where is possible to play poker 😄

Afortunadkrevix, gracias, amigo 😉

What do you mean? Could you explain your idea a little deeper, please?)

I'm going to live in Madrid. How i already checked, there are two big Casinos, where is possible to play poker 😄

You can play in the 2 casino´s. There is however one problem. Casino Arranjuez is aprox 30 min from Madrid and the one in Torrelodones is also 20/25 km outside the city centre.

You need a car, although there is a bus going a few times per night from the casino to the city centre.

In relation to the taxes an example

you start Jan 1: your roll is EUR 5,000

at the end of the year Dec 31: your roll is EUR 10,000 and you cashed out twice an amount of EUR 4,000 and 6,000.

You need to declare profits over an amount of EUR 5,000 + 4,000 + 6,000 = 15,000

hope it is clear

jackgYou can play in the 2 casino´s. There is however one problem. Casino Arranjuez is aprox 30 min from Madrid and the one in Torrelodones is also 20/25 km outside the city centre.

You need a car, although there is a bus going a few times per night from the casino to the city centre.

In relation to the taxes an example

you start Jan 1: your roll is EUR 5,000

at the end of the year Dec 31: your roll is EUR 10,000 and you cashed out twice an amount of EUR 4,000 and 6,000.

You need to declare profits over an amount of EUR 5,000 + 4,000 + 6,000 = 15,000

hope it is clear

No, if you deposit 5000€ and got 10000€ at the end of the year, you must pay for your net profit, in this case, 5000€, regardless you cashout it.

nokeeNo, if you deposit 5000€ and got 10000€ at the end of the year, you must pay for your net profit, in this case, 5000€, regardless you cashout it.

Yes that was i stated (10,000 minus 5,000) = 5,000 for the non cash out amount

and 6.000 + 4,000 for the amounts cashed out

jackgo, you want to say if i will make deposit for 1000€ and then, next day, cashout for 1000€, and will reapeat it 10 times, i will need to pay taxes for 10000€ of cashouts?:culpability:

no only profit 1000€(deposit)-1000€(cashout)=0€ don`t pay taxes